My experience: not what I ordered and bad customer service. Need I say more?
I recently received my first shipment from the Beer Of The Month Club sold by Amazing Clubs. They clearly promised on their web site “up to 4 different varieties” of beer, but only sent 2. When I inquired, they told me that the program now only shipped 2 varieties per month.
Since that meant that I would never receive “up to 4,” and since 2 is less than 4, I felt I had not received what I paid for. If I knew the club would only send 2 varieties, I would not have ordered from them.
While complaining to the company I was treated very rudely by Elena, the head of operations for this 10 million dollar firm. Since she could not counter my valid argument with one of her own, she just got more and more rude. I had to end the conversation because it was like arguing with an arrogant 12 year old.
Since I was treated so rudely, I emailed the president and followed up to get a reply. When he finally responded, he was just as rude as Elena and even more arrogant. He refused my request for a full refund, said he did not believe me and told me he was better off without me as a customer. In a subsequent email, he became insulting in the manner of a 12 year old.
Here is a copy/paste of the product description from the web site:
Each monthly selection features twelve bottles of hard-to-find, micro-brewed beer from two different award-winning breweries and each shipment includes up to four different varieties of premium beer.
Here are excerpts from his replies. I have not altered one word in the text selections below.
- -I do not agree with your email nor your comments regarding Elena Loyola
- -when it comes to Elena’s word vs. yours, it’s a very easy choice for me
- -Your decision to take your business elsewhere is a very good one for our company
- -Your interpretation of our product description aptly demonstrates your remedial understanding of the English language
- -And, by all means, please feel free to consider this email harassment
- -Best, John Paterson Founder
Subscribe to anyone
More fun email from the founder of Amazing Clubs. He keeps emailing me. Check out these excerpts from John Paterson. And check out their “unsatisfactory” rating on the Better Business Bureau site at http://www.connecticut.bbb.org.....d=30001345
Rob on July 10th, 2007 at 4:12 pm | Link
What part of “up to 4″ don’t I understand?
2 is clearly in the range of up to 4
If you got 12 bottles from two breweries…you got what is described…
Or am I wrong?
Amazing clubs is exactley that AMAZING. I have been using this company for 3 years, and never have i had any of this negative experience that this man talks about. I am a very fussy customer and do expect to get what i pay for. YOU DID GET WHAT YOU PAID FOR!
tracy sanchez on July 19th, 2007 at 3:33 pm | Link
I have to agree with all of the other commenters as well as the person at Amazing Clubs who sent you the emails. You did get exactly what you ordered. Nothing more - nothing less. If you you made this kind of unreasonable demand to my company, I think you’d get exactly the same kind of response. Amazing Clubs is lucky to lose you as a customer.
Kevin Wilkerson on July 20th, 2007 at 5:55 am | Link
I would agree that 2 is “up to four” IF they would have eventually sent me 3 or 4 in future shipments.
But when I inquired and the CSR told me that the program “would only be sending 2 varieties from now on” I realized that the program had changed and I would be assured of NEVER getting more than 2. That means I’ll get 2 at most, and never get the “up to 4″ that I thought I was buying.
Make sense?
Rob on July 20th, 2007 at 3:32 pm | Link
I responded about the “up to 4″ issue above. But to recap- when they change the program to “only sending 2 varieties” then I will never get “up to 4″ and so I did not get what I paid for. I think that I may not have clearly communicated in my original posting a subtle point: when I called to ask about receiving 2 varieties in my 1st shipment, I was told by the CSR that “the club now only sends 2 varieties.”
But forget that for a short moment and reply to this second issue: Do you think that the written abuse emailed by the founder of a company is reasonable? Even in this hide-behind-email world, don;t you find the response disturbing? And how would you have responded?
Rob on July 20th, 2007 at 3:39 pm | Link
You are not alone Rob. I had lots of problems with this company amazing clubs too. They are misleading and their employees are so very rude. I wanted up to 4 types of beer like advertised and we received 2 types for the entire term! I was mislead by their false advertising. They were terrible beers each month on top of it. When I called they didnt care about my complaint and they were so rude to me. They were just like take it or leave it attitude. I will never ever do business with them again. Someone should report them to the federal trade commission. I feel sorry for the what verbal abuse you had to go thru from the president of amazing clubs. thats sick!
Beth G. on July 20th, 2007 at 9:08 pm | Link
The arrogance of Paterson’s reply is … well … amazing. Even if your complaint was unreasonable (I don’t think it was), what kind of person takes the time to write a personally insulting and vulgar letter to a customer? And then he proudly declares it to be harassment!
If this is how Amazing Club’s owner exemplifies customer service, you have to wonder - is that the same attitude he takes when selecting the products he sells? Shudder.
I’ve gotten beer and flower shipments from C&H clubs for almost five years now and these guys are fantastic. You know exactly what you’re going to get because every single month’s selection is on their web site, along with all kinds of additional information. Their beer club is www.beermonthclub.com
I’ve had to deal with customer service several times and the people I speak with genuinely care and are very attentive. Never had anything less than a perfect resolution to whatever I was calling for.
Oh, and you do get 4 different beers every month - two types from two different breweries. And their beers are superb - I’ve never had a bad selection.
John B on July 21st, 2007 at 8:00 am | Link
@ everyone who is focusing on the “up to 4″ issue in this complaint - red herring folks. This is about the stunning customer service response provided by the President of, and the builder of … lets see, how did he say it “[one of] numerous multi-million dollar companies with hundreds of thousands of satisfied customers”.
Somebody wouldn’t last 5 minutes at McDonald’s berating customers like this.
I don’t know how much i believe of the belittling emails Rob said he received, why would the founder, take the time to write these nasty comments, to someone who cant understand what up to four means.
founders and Presidents usually have more to worry about than 1 customer complaining that they didn’t receive 4 different beers that month oh did you still receive the 12 beers that it promised too, or was the club short with that too.
tracy sanchez on August 9th, 2007 at 6:48 am | Link
Tracy, I agree that the president’s comments sound too rude to be real. Of course you don’t know me, so you can’t rely on my statement that this is all true.
But I must say that if I were going to make this up, I likely would not have created such rude fake emails. Any fake email would have been much less rude than the actual emails sent by the president. After all, who would believe that such rudeness was possible in response to a customer complaint.
It’s all true. Every word of his emails are accurately copied and pasted without alteration.
R
Rob on October 19th, 2007 at 11:49 am | Link
Hey, John B.
Thanks for the tip on the other club www.beermonthclub.com. It looks good and I’m asking for it for my birthday.
R
Rob on October 19th, 2007 at 11:50 am | Link
Sorry Rob,
But i cant believe you. I had an issue of going on vacation when my shipment was due, the company went out of their way to help me. No rudeness no nasty emails. They have been more than helpful.
But you don’t understand what up to 4 means so how can we believe what you write here.
Maybe you are unhappy but is it right to slander a company like that. As i see it i would not want to do business with you either.
Your lose.
t.s.
tracy on October 30th, 2007 at 3:09 pm | Link
I really do know what “up to 4 means.” It means that sometimes you’ll get 4, sometimes less. When they change the plan to “up to 2,” then I know that I will never receive the originally proposed 4- not ever. That’s not right, so I complained to them quite politely.
As for the emails from the founder, send him and email and ask if they are accurate: jp@icgamerica.com. Copy/paste my excerpts and ask him to reply. I would actually like to see if he has the character to stand up for his position. I fail to see the logic in not believing the accuracy of my representation of his emails. Since the “up to 4″ vs. “up to 2″ logic is flawed, then the jump to disbelief of the emails is as well.
R
Rob on November 14th, 2007 at 1:32 am | Link
Also- Better Business Bureau complaints about Amazing Clubs:
Customer Experience. Type in Amazing Clubs at http://www.connecticut.bbb.org
Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record
BBB Definition:
unsatisfactory record - A company has an “unsatisfactory business performance record” with the BBB is based on the experiences reflected in BBB files. This file condition results when the company has failed to resolve or respond to complaints, repeatedly failed to respond or resolve issues in a timely manner, failed to resolve the underlying issues for a pattern
BBB Definition:
pattern - More than 2 complaints involving the same allegations usually within 12 months that are significant in relation to the company’s size and volume of business.
of complaints, failed to honor their commitment to mediate or arbitrate disputes or honor mediated agreements or arbitrated decisions, failed to substantiate, modify or discontinue false advertising claims that are challenged by the BBB, or failed to discontinue unauthorized use of the BBB name and logo, a Federally protected trademark.
with the BBB due to unanswered complaints. The company has resolved
BBB Definition:
resolved - The company resolved the complaint issues.
some complaints presented by the BBB, however, the company did not respond to other complaints
BBB Definition:
other complaints - This refers to complaints from individuals or businesses that do not fall under a specific category.
.
When considering complaint information, please take into account the company’s size and volume of transactions, and understand that the nature of complaints and a firm’s responses to them are often more important than the number of complaints.
The BBB processed a total of 13 complaints about this company in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period.Of the total of 13 complaints closed in 36 months, 9 were closed in the last year.
Billing or Collection Issues
BBB Definition:
Billing or Collection Issues -
Complaints in this category generally include one or more of the following issues:
* billing errors
* unauthorized charges
* questionable collection practices
Resolved
BBB Definition:
Resolved - The company resolved the complaint issues.
1 - Company offered a partial (less than 100%) settlement which the consumer accepted.
1 - Company resolved
BBB Definition:
resolved - The company resolved the complaint issues.
the complaint issues. The consumer acknowledged acceptance to the BBB.
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
3 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Sales Practice Issues
BBB Definition:
Sales Practice Issues -
Complaints in this category generally include one or more of the following issues:
* alleged sales presentations made in person or by telephone that contain misrepresentations of the product or service
* high pressure sales practices
* failure to disclose key conditions of the offer
* verbal representations not consistent with written contractual terms or agreements
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
1 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Delivery Issues
BBB Definition:
Delivery Issues -
Complaints in this category generally include one or more of the following issues:
* delayed delivery of ordered merchandise
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
1 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Service Issues
BBB Definition:
Service Issues -
Complaints in this category generally include one or more of the following issues:
* claims of alleged delay in completing service
* failure to provide promised service
* inferior quality of provided service
* damaged merchandise as a result of delivery service
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
1 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Customer Service Issues
BBB Definition:
Service Issues -
Complaints in this category generally include one or more of the following issues:
* claims of alleged delay in completing service
* failure to provide promised service
* inferior quality of provided service
* damaged merchandise as a result of delivery service
BBB Definition:
Customer Service Issues -
Complaints in this category generally include one or more of the following issues:
* unsatisfactory customer service
* including personnel’s failure to provide assistance in a timely manner
* failure to address or respond to customer dissatisfaction
* unavailability for customer support
* inappropriate behavior or attitude exhibited by company staff
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
3 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Refund or Exchange Issues
BBB Definition:
Refund or Exchange Issues -
Complaints in this category generally include one or more of the following issues:
* failure to honor company policy or verbal commitment to provide refunds, exchanges, or credit for products or services.
Resolved
BBB Definition:
Resolved - The company resolved the complaint issues.
1 - Company resolved
BBB Definition:
resolved - The company resolved the complaint issues.
the complaint issues. The consumer acknowledged acceptance to the BBB.
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
1 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Rob on November 14th, 2007 at 1:39 am | Link
Rob -
Thanks for posting your experience. I was getting ready to get some Christmas shopping done and I came accross your comments. What an arrogant jerk.
I’ve also had a good experience in the past with the company John B mentioned as well as with www.monthclubstore.com. I really liked the selections I got with both of those companies - never had to deal with customer service at either.
P
Paul on November 27th, 2007 at 8:06 pm | Link
holy cow! you people deal with this treatment! There is a whole seperate page I found on more complaints on this company.
That is where my complaint is posted and more…
see this page also -
http://mybiggestcomplaint.com/.....o-amazing/
Tom Mackl on December 5th, 2007 at 5:26 pm | Link
Apparently all of you people that have posted comments about amazing clubs are incompetent human beings…if you read carefully, although it is in english you will clearly see that it says you will receive 2 to 4 different types of beer from two different breweries each month, ok lets see here, 2 breweries ok so that means that the least each can send is TWO different kinds from TWO different breweries. ok lets do math we learned in 1st grade….2 breweries that means that there are for the 1st one…..two different kinds, three bottles each six beeers from one brewery. Can you figure out the rest yourself or is the level of math and intelligence too much for a grown adult to figure out..amazing clubs has been nothing but perfect and respectful to me for years. Do you know why they are rude to you, because you are stupid and were probably dropped on your head way to many times as a child. Please keep your comments to yourself when you are too slow to understand something that is written in front of you and as easy as they make it out to be. INTELLIGENT PEOPLE WILL NOW GO TO ANOTHER SITE BECAUSE THEY THINK YOU ARE A RELIABLE SOURCE, WHOSE LYING TO WHOM NOW. I would not want to have you as a customer either, it is too much of a problem (as you can tell) to please you as a customer because you have nothing else better to do than bitch about a two beer difference. GET A JOB!
From,
A loyal customer (with common sense)
Nick on December 16th, 2007 at 3:07 am | Link
So as for the “mathematical calculations,” you are simply missing the point. If you review the original posting, you’ll understand the problem with the order and the “up to” that never occurs. Their change in the product specifications from the advertised “up to 4″ to a less desirable “up to 2″ is clear. Sorry to differ on your lengthy calculation, but the logic behind the “up to 2″ change is solid.
As for your interesting defense of Amazing Club’s attitude- If a merchant’s customers occasionally misunderstand something, or take a position that is, in the merchant’s opinion, incorrect, is it then acceptable for the merchant to be rude, harassing and unprofessional?
Of course that’s a rhetorical question. Good business practice calls for patients, tolerance and professional morality. Plus, we all know that you think it’s OK- you call great attention to your morally lacking attitude in your posting.
I think your posting speaks volumes about your personality. But I don’t play the insult game. If I did, I’d go on about your sentence structure as well.
Good day to you, sir.
Rob on January 6th, 2008 at 8:20 pm | Link
I’d also stay away from any other companies owned by this John Patterson and ICG America if you want to avoid this type of customer service. After doing some research, AmazingClubs.com, Flyingnoodle.com, Californiareds.com and Monsterbrew.com fall under ICG America.
Tommy on January 13th, 2008 at 11:56 am | Link
Wow, what a buch of smart consuemers you are. A little digging and you “got the goods” on these guys. I wish I had done that much homework.
I’m glad that people like you are discovering the apparent scam behind the company. I can’t believe that John even has a “AKA.” I’ll check that out for sure.
Rob on March 3rd, 2008 at 10:10 am | Link
I am so glad that I found this post because it really confirms my suspicions about this company.
I applied to their affiliate program 6 weeks ago, through Commission Junction and to this day, my request is still “pending” When I sent an email through CJ to Amazing Clubs, it remains unanswered.
I’ve been an affiliate marketer for a long time and this is a very big red flag. Today, I called their customer support number listed on their website, and while the girl I spoke to was not rude, she couldn’t tell me who their affiliate manager is, or give me any details as to my concerns,which I think are pretty obvious.
The only suggestion she could give me was to send an email to their support. At this point, I would rather withdraw my application and not be associated with the at all.
I stated to her that if if a merchant is this unresponsive, then it really begs the question of whether or not they care about their affiliates.
Obviously, Amazingclubs does not and I will be reporting this to Commission Junction.
Patty on April 15th, 2008 at 12:03 pm | Link
send an email to corey@icgamerica.com and he should help you solve your problem.
ernst on April 15th, 2008 at 1:22 pm | Link
I have personally gone through multiple court battles with John Paterson regarding things other than his business services and he is the biggest most arrogant piece of cocky scum I have ever seen in my life. He is very controlling and buys womens love. He is the most disgusting mentally distorted man I have ever met in my entire life. He deserves nothing but very bad things to happen to him.
Jessica on June 9th, 2008 at 1:42 pm | Link
I filed a complaint / comments with Commission Junction and their response to me was very generic. They really didn’t seem to care one way or the other.
Patty on June 9th, 2008 at 6:23 pm | Link
I know John Paterson is a bad person.
I know he treats women like scum and tries to control them.
He brags that he is sooo rich.
He has done things to women and children that would shock almost anyone.
He has mental problems yet puts them off on others.
He has done so many bad things to people. Its sad.
He couldn’t care less or regret it at all. He will do whatever he can to ruin you if you do anything to upset him.
Funny I have known this for years and years and years and I am still hearing it year after year about him. I am sorry you endured what you did with him Jessica. I wonder how your story compares to others.
William on December 2nd, 2008 at 5:37 pm | Link
Rob and Nick ……. sound like John Paterson himself.
William on December 2nd, 2008 at 5:41 pm | Link